TV and LJ collide

[sistermagpie]

So did anybody else happen to connect QAF tonight with recent lj discussions?



Ben asked Michael to read his book and tell him what he thought. Michael is nervous because he thougt it was boring. So he tells him he loved it. Then Ben hears from others this isn't the truth so encourages Michael to be honest. Michael says, okay, he felt it dragged in parts. He didn't really understand what the main character wanted. He couldn't really tell what it was about. He didn't get how it all added up in the end. Ben gets miffed and forgives Michael for his stupid thoughts because he doesn't have a "literary background" and likes comic books instead. He sends the book to his publisher, who passes on it because the main character's motivation wasn't clear, the theme wasn't presented with any force and the plot was too complex.

Yeah, we all saw that coming, but of course it made me think of the recent lj discussions about criticism not being welcome, which I don't really understand. I understand not everyone is in this to improve as a writer and they just want to have fun. I defiitely see why people hold the opinions of some trusted friends and writers they admire above others. I definitely know that some negative feedback is just wrong and unhelpful. These are not things I would argue with.

But what I don't get is having any trouble with the kind of feedback Michael was giving Ben here, which seemed to be part of what was being rejected. I mean, Michael wasn't telling Ben how to write, he was just telling him what, as a reader, he didn't get. And even if you're just in it for the fun of it what is the point if you're not getting your point across? You don't have to write what the reader wants to read, but surely you want the reader to hear what you're saying! This is not something one needs to have a literary background to do. Many people are completely incapable of putting their problems with a story into something as coherent as, "I didn't understand what the main character wanted..." They'll just say it was boring and move on. I think comments like that are valuable no matter who they come from. They're worth at least a second opinion from someone you trust.

Comments

[malafede.livejournal.com]

(deleted & reposted because my typo alert went off!)

I think the best advice I was given on criticism came from a friend of mine: he told me I needed to learn how to discriminate between criticism that's in tune with my vision, and criticism that doesn't accept it as a postulate. Of course disagreement over the premise is possible, but it doesn't say much about someone's writing.

I know it was rather painful for me to learn this lesson. In a writing workshop I joined, we shared our writing and were invited to share our opinions on our classmates's writing too. Receiving criticism was strange - I was incredibly glad someone had taken the time to think about what worked in my story and what didn't. When they pointed out flaws, it helped me to see the reader's perspective, which is the entire point of writing for me. A story is a way to talk with people, and without feedback there's no communication.

Of course criticism hurts, at times. A story especially where I had put a lot of energies and themes I cared about was called inconsistent once. My reaction was very negative, I felt untalented and frustrated, so it's not that I don't sympathise with the pov of the one who's resistant to criticism. Just, I never felt angry at the people pointing out the holes in my narrative, but rather at myself for having them in the first place.

A reader whose response to your Draco gen piece us to worder why there wasn't buttsex isn't giving you any helpful input, not because of the buttsex per se, but because it has nothing to do with your story. But someone who points out discrepancies in the Malfoys's timeline is, and it's very likely that they're telling you because they enjoy your story and want to see it improved.

[sistermagpie.livejournal.com]

Yeah, it's a much harder thing that people realize sometimes. In fact, sometimes you just don't know what's going to set you off. I remember when I wrote something and gave it to this woman who was an agent--she's now my writing partner. I didn't know her very well then, but she went through it and gave criticisms that were totally like therapy--like, you don't realize how much yourself you reveal in something. Luckily I'm so fascinated in myself I could sort of enjoy that part of it even while being embarassed.:-)

But still that can be hard and a lot of people just don't really get it. And when you're listening to people just sort of brush aside your story to tell you to write something else it's like, "Hello? My story? The one I want to tell?"

Just, I never felt angry at the people pointing out the holes in my narrative, but rather at myself for having them in the first place.


Heh--I am totally the same way. Because I at least want to look competent, dammit! Plus I never want to sound like I'm one of those people who are just going to defend every criticism. Like if you say something doesn't make sense they explain how it does make sense, as if they can do this to every person who ever picks up a book if it gets published. There's nothing more annoying than people who think the proper way to deal with criticism is to just argue it down. I mean, sure, you don't have to accept every criticism and follow it because sometimes the person is wrong, but you don't win points by being able to not listen to it at all.

[malafede.livejournal.com]

like, you don't realize how much yourself you reveal in something. Luckily I'm so fascinated in myself I could sort of enjoy that part of it even while being embarassed.:-)

Eeeeh I'm the same. It's amazing how many things you can learn about yourself reading your stuff with an eye to projection. I remember the same friend who gave the bit of advice about criticism firing question after question at me about why I chose X as the main character, why was it so important that he died, why was I fond of this and this and this clichè... he said it was to know me better. Back then I really didn't understand projection and reacted very badly at the implication that my only link with characters could be identification... Are we all Mary Sues?, I asked. Because I knew for certain that sometimes I didn't want to be in the scene, I just wanted to observe. I had these two twins in an incestuous relationship and both their personalities were so different from mine. But talking with him helped me to understand that both my fascination with incest between twins and disturbed personalities said something about me.

There's nothing more annoying than people who think the proper way to deal with criticism is to just argue it down.

Yeah, it's diffult for me to undestand this attitude because it feels so lacking in humbleness. I mean, I don't think I'm flawless. I don't think my prose is. So it's not so unthinkable that someone could spot these flaws I know I have.