Hmm. I'll say it again: you get into some strange conversations about LOTR.
I think the only reason I might see book Frodo as more heroic than movie Frodo is because in the book, he knows more what he's giving up. In the movie he is definitly choosing to do self-sacrificing things, but it's also happening very quickly and he's being swept along. Things are slower in the book and he has more time to reflect on how dangerous it is and how much he is giving up. I think his changed age is also related to this.
But other than things like that, I don't understand the points the other person was trying to make. The Osama quote didn't even make sense to me, though I figured it out from your comments. I like Tolkien's quote on the two kinds of pity (though I'm partial to calling them "pity" and "compassion" and separating them like that, which I drew from Milan Kundera and has some etymological reasons behind it, except not in English). I think Frodo's pity for Gollum was a combination of the two. Sometimes it was only the disdainful pity, but that was enough as it kept him from killing Gollum. And sometimes it was the more compassionate sort of pity, where he really understood what Gollum was going through. There was a mix. And it might have ended up being less interesting in the movie, but as you said it's what can be shown when you don't have narration.
On a related note, I reread the third book recently and I kind of miss the moment where Sam also feels pity for Gollum (certainly the disdainful kind, but still) and lets him go. This is when he gets to fight Gollum alone while Frodo runs ahead to the crack. He wins the fight and wants to kill Gollum once and for all, yet then he feels sorry for him and doesn't.
I suspect Frodo hoped it would be officially announced that he was surrounded by idiots.
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Date: 2004-04-03 09:38 am (UTC)I think the only reason I might see book Frodo as more heroic than movie Frodo is because in the book, he knows more what he's giving up. In the movie he is definitly choosing to do self-sacrificing things, but it's also happening very quickly and he's being swept along. Things are slower in the book and he has more time to reflect on how dangerous it is and how much he is giving up. I think his changed age is also related to this.
But other than things like that, I don't understand the points the other person was trying to make. The Osama quote didn't even make sense to me, though I figured it out from your comments. I like Tolkien's quote on the two kinds of pity (though I'm partial to calling them "pity" and "compassion" and separating them like that, which I drew from Milan Kundera and has some etymological reasons behind it, except not in English). I think Frodo's pity for Gollum was a combination of the two. Sometimes it was only the disdainful pity, but that was enough as it kept him from killing Gollum. And sometimes it was the more compassionate sort of pity, where he really understood what Gollum was going through. There was a mix. And it might have ended up being less interesting in the movie, but as you said it's what can be shown when you don't have narration.
On a related note, I reread the third book recently and I kind of miss the moment where Sam also feels pity for Gollum (certainly the disdainful kind, but still) and lets him go. This is when he gets to fight Gollum alone while Frodo runs ahead to the crack. He wins the fight and wants to kill Gollum once and for all, yet then he feels sorry for him and doesn't.
I suspect Frodo hoped it would be officially announced that he was surrounded by idiots.
That cracked me up. :)