Okay, I've been reading a bunch of posts and getting the uncomfortable feeling that I'm still in the boat of seeing something slightly different going on with Draco's characterization than some other people. This post is long, cause I went through a lot. Basically...



I've been seeing this alternate view of his storyline in HBP that's supposed to go against the too-fluffy fangirl version. Basically that version goes like this: We didn't learn much about Draco in HBP, and there wasn’t much new here. He was useful as a plot device doing what he always did on a bigger scale: he talked big and then he chickened out at the end and was too much of a pussy to either kill Dumbledore or switch sides. Oh, and he also almost killed Katie and Ron and that isn’t made up for by him being too chicken to kill Dumbledore when he had to look him in the eye and Dumbledore was still tougher than he was. We see him vulnerable crying in the bathroom because he’s tired and stressed.

This is just not what I think the point of his story is--in fact, I really can't imagine JKR wasting that much page time on that story. I certainly can’t imagine she'd waste Albus Dumbledore’s death scene and very last words of wisdom on it. When I first read spoilers about Draco's being coerced into doing something, the most I hoped for was a storyline not much bigger than the one's he's had before, but with a little twist to make Harry think about it, sort of like learning about Neville's parents. That's not what I got here, imo. I think JKR went to the trouble of creating an arc here for Draco and let Harry see enough signs of it that a reader should be able to put it together, because it ties in to what Dumbledore stands for, and so some of the main themes of the book. Those themes and how they play out are, imo, probably why she was so pleased with the book.

First I think it's important to remember that in this universe murder is not an act of bravery. Killing is sometimes necessary, but murder, especially the murder of an innocent, defenseless person, is wrong. Harry's killing Voldemort is not murder because it's not only revenge; Voldemort is hurting and killing others. Killing Peter was wrong, even if he was also guilty of James and Lily's death. And speaking of Peter, fandom argues over whether his acts are brave or cowardly, but I think we can all agree that canonically they are not supposed to be admirable. Draco's killing Dumbledore in that scene really would not have made him a badass any more than it makes Peter one. Really, the one chance for Draco to not become a coward, imo, is clearly in resisting Voldemort, not finding it in himself to kill for him. And btw, let’s remember this book is also about Tom Riddle, who's the one who can kill.

There's something about Draco that's been stressed over and over in previous books that was so obvious I didn’t even see it: Draco is a boy to whom death is unreal. Every single book has a reference to this, sometimes many references. One of the first things he does to annoy Harry is reply to Harry's line that his parents are dead by saying, "Oh, sorry," in a way that "doesn't sound sorry at all" to Harry. Now, I've always thought Harry was a little silly in that reaction, because what reaction did he want? Draco's polite, if automatic, response was perfectly appropriate. Now I see it was more than that. It's stressed that he doesn't sound sorry, which Harry takes as insulting, because it's the first sign that Draco really has no reaction to the idea of death. Harry might as well have said, "My parents are bankers." Draco knows what the appropriate response is supposed to be and gives it, but Harry is right that he doesn't *feel* anything, not even what a stranger who has some idea of death would feel. It's completely unreal to him. On the train, later, he throws James and Lily’s death in Harry's face and sounds chilling and inhuman threatening him with the same fate—he understands it logically, but it’s not real.

In CoS (which this book harkens back to it in so many ways) we have Draco crowing over the petrifactions (CoS being another book full of *near deaths* where someone comes close to the line but remains innocent), wishing he could help the Heir and picking out which Muggleborns he'd like to see go first. He knows a Muggleborn died the last time this happened, and that means maybe he wouldn’t have to see Granger anymore. It's unreal as actual death.

In PoA he flirts with death *again* in the Buckbeak storyline, taunting the Trio and Hagrid with the fact that this animal is going to be executed for slashing him. Again he's saved from really causing a death when the execution is stopped.

In the fourth book he mouths off about Cedric Diggory, though once again cluelessness is at work. Much is made of his taunt that "Diggory was the first" but I think from his pov he's stating a fact. Harry should have chosen the right side, and Cedric's death is only proof of that, not a "real death" that he understands. I don't think Cedric’s death, as an event in itself, even registers with him.

The fifth book introduces Thestrals, which Draco responds to with a bored, "What are we supposed to be seeing?" He can't see what's in front of him; he claims to be unimpressed. In fact, when Ron expresses surprise that three people in their one class have seen death Draco suggests that perhaps if Ron himself "saw someone snuff it" he'd be able to see the Quaffle better. He’s completely unaffected by the class. Death=being able to see some stupid animal Hagrid likes, a reason Harry should have taken his hand on the train, a way of getting back at Hagrid and the Trio, a way of getting rid of people he doesn't like. It has no power whatsoever in itself for Draco...up until this book.

In HBP he's asked to murder someone and responds as always--it will get him glory, it's an honor, it makes him cool. There's so many echoes of CoS in this book, and the main one is that Draco has now gotten his wish: he is helping the Heir. So when does this start to go wrong? Well, many pointed out that Draco may not kill DD but he almost kills Katie and then Ron, so people should not dismiss this. The thing is, not only should we not dismiss it, I don't think we should assume that *Draco* dismisses it. The accidents with Katie and Ron must occur for plot reasons--we can't know there's a murder plot without murder attempts. But I think they are also important for Draco's arc in the story. I said that CoS was a book full of almost-murders committed with the help of still-innocent Ginny Weasley. HBP has Draco's plot on Dumbledore, and also Harry's duel with Draco. I'm going to have to talk about that duel for a second to get to what I mean.

Harry is horrified by the results of the Sectusempra spell, which tips Snape off to Harry having his old book with extra results that Levicorpus wouldn't give. Harry almost kills Draco there just as surely as Draco almost kills Katie and Ron. I think there's a reason Rowling used a spell that was so Muggle-ishly messy. This isn't AK that simply removes life from a person cleanly. Harry literally rips Draco open. There's tons of blood and white hands scrabbling at his chest--not to mention Draco shaking uncontrollably. Afterwards Ginny and Hermione argue over this, though both of them are still innocents compared to Harry. Hermione is yammering about his missing Quidditch for using a bad spell and Ginny (she of the bat bogey hex) is coldly congratulating Harry for having something good up his sleeve in the duel--neither of them get what makes Harry feel that pang of conscience. Myrtle as witness is a particularly nice touch here, especially her screams of MURDER IN THE BATHROOM!

I think that's a bit of a clue to exactly what Malfoy is going through with his murder attempts. My book has not yet arrived from AmazonUK (*taps foot impatiently*), but going from memory these are things we know about those attempts. Katie touches the necklace, I believe, on the first Hogsmeade weekend. Certainly Snape and Draco argue about it during Slughorn's party, which I believe was a Christmas party. Ron's accident happens in March, but Slughorn specifically says that the mead Ron drank was intended as a Christmas present--he's had it for a while now. I think it's safe to assume that these represent all of Malfoy's attempts at murder until the end of the book--we'd hear about other attempts gone awry. So it's a curious thing about these two attempts: both of them take place early in the year, pre-Christmas. In fact, couldn't he have set in motion both at the same time? Malfoy is not trying to kill Dumbledore all year; he gives up and concentrates on the cabinet, putting off the murder until he figures he absolutely has to.

I think there's good reason to think that Katie's accident, even if Malfoy didn't see it, affected him a great deal. It's at the Christmas party that Harry first notices that Malfoy look ill--after the necklace. Harry notices Malfoy looking sickly twice--here, and later when he thinks he looks thinner, just like Tonks. Tonks who is pining for Remus, yes, but also is said to be suffering from guilt over the MoM. Draco has plenty of reasons to feel stressed, but the text specifically compares him to Tonks. Again I don’t have my book, but doesn’t Harry notice Draco looking ill for the second time in the Potions class during the Apparition tests? That puts it after Ron’s birthday and his poisoning. Which means that both near-deaths are followed by Harry noticing a marked change for the worse in Malfoy’s appearance (iow, it's not just a gradual worsening all year from the stress--it's two specific times). He could fear getting caught, but really, that’s never a real threat and Harry notices no signs of him looking specifically paranoid, just signs that he’s unable to eat or sleep. In fact, I'd believe getting caught would be a relief. I think we should consider that Malfoy was very shaken by both Katie’s accident and Ron’s.

Then there's those echoes of CoS. The almost-murders, Draco helping the Heir and finally--there's Myrtle. HP is kind of unique in that it's a story where you can literally talk to murder victims and that's what Draco does in HBP. Does he know who Myrtle is? Probably not. But surely it's important who she is. She's the very girl he happily told stories about in second year, "The last time the Chamber was opened, a Mudblood died." She's Voldemort the schoolboy's first murder victim who’s now comforting Draco about his problem. Probably neither of them know that they've been stuck in the bathroom by the exact same guy, or that they should be natural enemies. The significance, imo, isn't just that Draco seems to start to see Myrtle as a person, or reaches out to a Muggleborn, or that they’re both Voldemort’s victims. It's also, I think, some serious atonement for his previous wishes, even if he doesn't know it yet (I think he may find out).

But Draco can't put it off forever, and eventually we get to that final showdown with DD. I just don't see how this can just be seen as a loss of nerve, first of all because I think Draco's already admitted to himself on some level that he can't kill and that's why he stopped making attempts. DD isn't talking Draco out of murder in this scene--he's confident from the get-go that he's not going to murder anyone. Draco is *confessing* to DD in this scene-confessing to his intended victim. When DD tells him he's not a killer he's not, as some have claimed, simply intimidating Draco by telling him he can't do it. He's reassuring him as well (though that’s complicated since where Draco comes from it’s *not* a compliment to be told you’re not a murderer). When DD says he's not a killer Draco says, "You don't know what I've done." This could be taken (as can so many of Snape's and Draco's important lines in this book) two ways. It could be a boast or it could be an admission of guilt—Draco is saying he *is* a killer, because look what he's done. He almost killed Katie and Ron. But honestly, I don't think he's gloating about it. We've seen Draco gloat. He could easily have said he didn't care what happened to Katie and as for Ron--dude, it's Ron Weasley he almost killed. His enemy. Someone who allegedly deserved to die for being a blood traitor. But he isn't gloating, and those deeds didn’t seem to make him very happy. He veers back and forth between what he's always said he wanted and thought to be true (killing for Voldemort would be glorious) and the reality of how he feels about the situation. Dumbledore, meanwhile, very carefully makes sure he knows exactly where he stands. He *assures* him that he's not a killer, but also stresses that these almost-murders are very real and it was only luck that saved him.

There's just too much here for the kind of about-face people are also criticizing Draco for not making. Having him leap to DD's side at this point is just...it's fake. It doesn't take in the stress Draco has been going through all year and the real danger of his situation. In fact, I think it would be worth looking at that scene with DD line by line to see what's going on in it. I’ve said in the past that I always thought Draco ought and seemed to be on the dark path, moving towards a dark night of the soul, where everything he previously believed and understood is taken away—I think that’s what he got. He's still in his dark night here—we've yet to see what will come in the day. Rowling has said books 6 and 7 are like two halves of the same story and of course they are. This is the halfway cliffhanger. Draco is still innocent in terms of being a killer, but death is now a very real thing to him. He can’t ever again say he didn’t know. So only now is he able to make a real choice. We don't know what kind of choices he will make in the next book--I don't think we can know, since the lightning struck tower was in many ways a symbolic death for Draco. One thing is for sure, though.

By the end of the Sixth Book, Draco Malfoy can see Thestrals.
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From: [identity profile] merelyn.livejournal.com


Hi! I'm Mere, I was just randomly friendsfriends hopping on lj, and I just wanted to let you know real quick that your formatting is off, so the cut tag isn't working, so the spoilers are all...out there. I don't mind them, but some other folks might. Uh...bye!

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From: [identity profile] fiamaya.livejournal.com


Hi (I wandered by randomly). What a great analysis! I never read him as gloating in the showdown w/ DD; I entirely agree that he's shaky and feeling guilty, with the lines like "You don't know what I've done". You've done a convincing job of drawing that guilt back, and showing how he changed this year -- I found the observation that he really changed after Katie's accident particularly telling.

Draco has to be important to book 7; DD's final scene can't be irrelevant.
ext_6866: (Watching and waiting)

From: [identity profile] sistermagpie.livejournal.com


Yeah, it seems like DD has given Harry all the mentoring he needs and it can't be unimportant that he turns his last moments to Draco, even stunning Harry to do it.

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trobadora: (Icon: absynthia; artwork: lunulet)

From: [personal profile] trobadora


You know, I was skimming your post before reading it, and I caught the phrase:

going to be executed for slashing him

... and just burst out giggling.

(Sorry - even for me, that's a pretty inane comment. But other than that all I can say is that I agree with you completely.)
ext_6866: (WWSMD?)

From: [identity profile] sistermagpie.livejournal.com


LOL--Let's face it, if they start executing people for slashing Draco it's going to get pretty lonely around here...

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From: [identity profile] nmalfoy.livejournal.com - Date: 2005-07-19 05:46 pm (UTC) - Expand

From: [identity profile] maeglinyedi.livejournal.com


Very interesting post! You make a good case for Draco and his behavior. After HBP, I had a bit of trouble seeing how Draco couldn't not be a killer on some level, what with the necklace and poison. And the difference between that and Harry's dark curse being that Draco must have known what a deadly curse on a necklace and a poison can do: they will kill a person. While Harry, being the clueless boy that he is had no idea what curse he was using. But I really like your explanation of how Draco doesn't understand death at first: he understands it on a technical level, but not on an emotional one. That's something I hadn't considered before, and that indeed explains why he was able to send a cursed necklace and a poison, but wasn't able to kill Dumbledore in the end. Great post!
ext_6866: (Good point.)

From: [identity profile] sistermagpie.livejournal.com


Oh yes, there's a big difference in what Harry does in the bathroom and what Draco does. Harry is using something he literally doesn't understand. Draco really does the opposite--Harry is surprised because he doesn't get the result he imagined. Draco gets exactly the result he allegedly wanted--somebody gets poisoned/cursed. But I think Draco needed to honestly be responsible for that to start to understand what was happening. And Harry, really, needed something similar. He's got to kill Voldemort eventually, we assume, so it's probably good that he, too, got a practice run.

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From: [identity profile] imkalena.livejournal.com - Date: 2005-07-20 03:22 am (UTC) - Expand
ext_2233: Writing MamaDeb (Default)

From: [identity profile] mamadeb.livejournal.com


This is going to be a first.

I have absolutely no quibbles at all about this post. In fact, I think it's gorgeous. Draco has no experience with death (okay, most kids his age haven't) and he hasn't been raised to value empathy, so he doesn't quite get why he should care. But he's NOT Tom Riddle - he's not a sociopath.

Yay.
cleverthylacine: a cute little thylacine (Default)

From: [personal profile] cleverthylacine


I think it's also important to realise that none of the things Draco tried involved him having to actually kill Albus face to face. Poison and cursed objects don't kill up close and personal--and with someone as powerful as Albus are very unlikely to work, for that matter. (If I were a powerful witch in this universe all of my china would be charmed to detect poison and I wouldn't be eating out a lot.)

You can chalk this up to cowardice, but you can also chalk it up to not really wanting to kill someone, at least subconsciously.

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From: [identity profile] sistermagpie.livejournal.com - Date: 2005-07-19 05:40 pm (UTC) - Expand

From: [identity profile] wordplay.livejournal.com


I don't know - I mean, you know I really LIKE Draco and I prefer this interpretation of his actions, but I still think there's another interpretation available. I mean, when he's crying in the bathroom, that could just be stress that so far he's been failing in his set task. Yes, those signs of stress you mention above probably aren't fear of getting caught, and they could be signs of feeling shaken or feeling guilty, but I think it equally likely that they're signs that he's starting to feel like he just can't get it right, and is feeling the pressure of what might happen if he fails. Is there evidence opposing that interpretation, or is this just one of those ambiguities we're going to have to live with until we see what happens next?
ext_6866: (Watching and waiting)

From: [identity profile] sistermagpie.livejournal.com


Oh well, definitely he's got other stresses. It's far to noble for him to be just worrying about hurting others when he's got all these other stresses. I think he is definitely worried about him and his family being killed because he can't bring it off, but I think Dumbledore's own interpretation is important. In the end he probably *could* get it right, after all. Dumbledore is ailing and wandless, the DEs are there. He might even have tried the AK and failed. If his biggest fear is what happens if he fails, then I think we'd get signs that he was at least trying to get up his nerve in those last moments. ETA: Also, he doesn't go to Snape for help which he seems to know he can do. I mean, in the beginning he doesn't want his help because this is his chance for glory etc., but if he really wasn't getting it right, and his family's lives were at stake, it surprises me he wouldn't go to Snape for any help...unless he was afraid he might actually get it.:-)

He could, of course, still become a killer later, sure. But I hope not.:-)

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From: [identity profile] jodel-from-aol.livejournal.com - Date: 2005-07-19 06:38 pm (UTC) - Expand
ext_18536: (Snotty Boyd)

From: [identity profile] mizbean.livejournal.com


Honestly, insinuating that Draco is cowardly for not killing Dumbledore is just dumb. And it goes against everything JKR has given us.

I had wondered that if he indeed lacked remorse about nearly killing Katie Bell or Ron if he wouldn't have said something sneering or insinuating about it, especially towards Ron who he so dislikes. But he doesn't.

And the Thestrals. I remembered that shortly after I finished the book. I'm inclined to think Draco will feel haunted by what happened and will not kill again. I think this remorse is where Harry can appeal to him, should they run into each other in the next book, which I'm sure they will
ext_6866: (Watching and waiting)

From: [identity profile] sistermagpie.livejournal.com


I feel like the fact that Harry was a silent witness to this entire last scene with DD and Draco means it's got to come in handy later. Harry is the one who saw Draco's face and heard his confession--any attempts of Draco's to put on a brave face are probably not going to work with Harry.

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From: [identity profile] darklites.livejournal.com


Draco's complete lack of understanding to what death really is really illuminates some of his past behaviour. I love it!

I also find it hard to understand how one could see Draco being unable to kill Dumbledore 'cowardly' in terms of canon's rules. First of all, it is not as if Dumbledore could fight back at this point - he is severely weakened and lacking a wand. If Draco wanted to kill him, he could probably easily cast a successful AK. And second, even *after* the Death Eater 'backup' comes into the tower, Draco *still* can't kill Dumbledore. Instead, he shows "less resolution than ever" when they DEs prod him to cast the AK. At this point, Draco not only has backup, but is also keenly aware that if he *doesn't* kill Dumbledore, he will be taken to Voldemort and (along with his family) likely be killed. Draco does not know that Snape will come in to save him. Dumbledore is clearly no help against the other DEs who are in the tower at this point. To Draco, the choices are laid out there: kill Dumbledore and escape with the Death Eaters - and get the 'glory above all others', *or* not kill Dumbledore, leading to what he expects (and plausibly at this point) to be almost certain death.

Draco wavers not because he's too scared to kill Dumbledore. He wavers because he is choosing between his life and his conscience, and it seems to me - as it seemed to Dumbledore, and Harry - that he was going to choose his conscience over his life.

I love that brat.
ext_6866: (I brought chips!)

From: [identity profile] sistermagpie.livejournal.com


Hee-and it's so perfect from someone who probably didn't even know he *had* a conscience! I remember in the GoF QWC scene when there was the debate that Draco tried to warn the Trio away from the DEs I always thought no, he's not warning them, but he's not getting them to go over there either. Not because he's a good person but because he's just not a psycho. Killing Hermione, however he might say it was great in CoS, just isn't really an option.

And I do think it's important to think that in the end by "chickening out" Draco was choosing his own and his family's death over DD's, possibly without really knowing why. He also didn't go to Snape for help when he wasn't succeeding on his own--in fact he's telling DD that Snape wanted to kill him (DD) too. I think his trembling in the end is not because he's afraid to kill DD, because he's not going to kill him, but because he's afraid of what's going to happen to him because he can't.

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From: [identity profile] ficangel.livejournal.com


Once again, I love this post.

I hadn't thought of how Draco's signs of stress all occured after his murder attempts. It's also very interesting to me that both of these attempts are long distance. The necklace could be seen as a form of poisoning, and the mead unequivocally was. There's a reason that poison is considered the coldest and least personal way of killing someone-you don't have to be in a rage to do it, don't have to pause and watch your own work. I think the victims surviving and taking such a long time recovering certainly shook Draco more out of his adolescent views of death than he would have been if they had just dropped dead without him seeing it. This way, he had to watch and be aware of them recovering.
ext_6866: (I'm looking at you)

From: [identity profile] sistermagpie.livejournal.com


I hope it doesn't turn out I'm wrong about those signs of stress, but I think they're both after the murder attempts. And yes, it's true that poison is totally a different form of murderer than murdering up close--that's what I've always heard. Just think of those people who even kill strangers that way tampering with products in stores.

Honestly, I suspect if Draco had been there when, say, Katie was cursed he probably would have been too horrified to hide it.

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From: [personal profile] coughingbear - Date: 2005-07-19 10:02 pm (UTC) - Expand

From a distance

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ext_3190: Red icon with logo "I drink Nozz-a-la- Cola" in cursive. (snapetrio)

From: [identity profile] primroseburrows.livejournal.com


I love reading your analyses of various things, especially when it comes to my Draco. And I agree with you. This is indeed Draco's dark night of the soul--and the good thing is, we're actually being given a glimpse into Draco's soul, which is something I never expected JKR to give us.

Draco is a product of his upbringing, and even though his parents are bigots and loyal to Voldemort's cause (although for Narcissa Draco's well-being transcends even that), they still love Draco and IMO wouldn't unnecessarily expose him to death. They would, being the bigots and Voldemort-supporters that they are, speak offhand about death, and even tell Draco that Muggles and Mudbloods are less than human and deserve death. So no, Draco wouldn't have seen death, it wouldn't be real to him, and that was made clear in OoTP.

What we know from HBP is that Draco is redeemable (if that's even the right word here given Draco's relative innocence), but he's not yet redeemed (again, if that word even applies). He has to make the next choice, but he does HAVE a choice. And I think he's going to be thinking about it. A lot.

He also may not only have the Order on his tail, but the DEs as well. Snape is oathbound to protect him, no matter what his loyalties are (and that's another long post entirely). It'll be interesting to speculate about what choices Draco will make, and how the situation he's in will affect those choices.

From: [identity profile] volkhvoi.livejournal.com


I'm wondering about how Snape's position is going to affect Draco's choices. Especially since I still think Snape is a loyal member of the OofP. He is in a difficult position to try to reenforce Dumbledore's final effort with Draco.

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From: [identity profile] viverra-libro.livejournal.com - Date: 2005-07-19 10:34 pm (UTC) - Expand

From: [identity profile] dorrie6.livejournal.com


There's something about Draco that's been stressed over and over in previous books that was so obvious I didn’t even see it: Draco is a boy to whom death is unreal.

Dude, I've been saying this forever. :)
ext_6866: (la_pensee in the Garden of Wasted Things)

From: [identity profile] sistermagpie.livejournal.com


Hee! Yes, you definitely have! Well, I mean, I always said it when people accused him of literally wanting Hermione dead and mocking Cedric. It was always part of my interpretation of different scenes (as all Draco fans have said since OotP--he can't see Thestrals). I just never realized that this was one of the main points of the character that would be a plot in itself!

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From: [identity profile] dorrie6.livejournal.com - Date: 2005-07-19 06:21 pm (UTC) - Expand

ROFL

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From: [identity profile] violaswamp.livejournal.com


Honestly, the whole "he just did it out of cowardice" thing sounds to me like a fanwank on the part of people who don't want a redeemed Draco.

If nothing else, Dumbledore says otherwise. He says it's guilt and innate...decency, for lack of a better word, that keeps Draco from killing him.

And Draco reacts to this the way people react to truths they don't want to hear: loud but shaky denials and eventual confession.

Also, if Draco's shakiness over the attacks on Katie and Ron was due to mere fear of getting caught, then why isn't he scared over his Vanishing Cabinet antics? Frankly, it's easier to connect that with Draco than the Katie and Ron incidents.

Besides, I agree that it would be very unlike Rowling to portray killing someone as a test of bravery and a refusal to kill as an act of cowardice. And what would have been at all scary about killing a helpless Dumbledore? He can't have been afraid of getting into trouble, since he would have had not only protection but glory from the DEs. The only scary thing about killing a person who can't fight back and whose murder you won't be punished for is its moral consequences.
ext_6866: (Good point.)

From: [identity profile] sistermagpie.livejournal.com


If nothing else, Dumbledore says otherwise. He says it's guilt and innate...decency, for lack of a better word, that keeps Draco from killing him.

Yes--and frankly, I'd hope that this would be linked to his family, too. There's this uneasy balance between people like Tom Riddle, who seemed born to be evil, and people like Harry and Sirius who are born in circumstances that should make them bad, but they are not. I think we're ready for the next level, where Draco possibly belongs. Someone whose family is "evil," but who is nevertheless not "evil" himself, not because of some blessing at birth but a combination of his nature and his upbringing.

The only scary thing about killing a person who can't fight back and whose murder you won't be punished for is its moral consequences.

Exactly--whether in the form of guilt or some imagined retribution from a punishing God or whatever. Wasn't Peter's defense, after all, that the bad guys were going to win?

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From: [identity profile] violaswamp.livejournal.com - Date: 2005-07-21 03:26 am (UTC) - Expand

From: [identity profile] http://users.livejournal.com/_rp_zeal_/


I think JKR went to the trouble of creating an arc here for Draco and let Harry see enough signs of it that a reader should be able to put it together, because it ties in to what Dumbledore stands for, and so some of the main themes of the book. Those themes and how they play out are, imo, probably why she was so pleased with the book.

I am glad that I am not alone in thinking that Draco's arc playing out brilliantly, making sense of Dumbledore's central beliefs (it's one's choice that defines them, seeing the best in people) and some of the main themes of this series work, was what made HBP Rowling's favorite book yet. Though I hesitate to voice this view as it might seem like something a deluded, self-important Draco fan would say ;-)

Rowling has said books 6 and 7 are like two halves of the same story

She has? Can't really remember, do you still have the link?

And word to the rest of your essay :D
ext_6866: (Cousins)

From: [identity profile] sistermagpie.livejournal.com


I am glad that I am not alone in thinking that Draco's arc playing out brilliantly, making sense of Dumbledore's central beliefs (it's one's choice that defines them, seeing the best in people) and some of the main themes of this series work, was what made HBP Rowling's favorite book yet.

Hee--I hope so, deluded fangirl that I am. I just find it impossible to believe that the answer to the mystery is that Dumbledore was, in fact, wrong for seeing the good in people and we should all be a little more cynical and not make leaps of faith like that. He never told Harry why he trusted Snape, and he was the person who *didn't* get sucked in by Tom Riddle, so obviously Rowling's not talking about just being seduced by a pleasant exterior and a sob story!

I have no idea where I remember hearing the thing about books 6 & 7, unfortunately.

the missing link

From: [identity profile] sophie-spence.livejournal.com - Date: 2005-07-22 06:27 am (UTC) - Expand

From: [identity profile] manikaitwing.livejournal.com

Draco and the Dementors?


In PoA, Draco was teasing Harry about fainting in front of the Dementors, but Fred and George said that he came running to hide in their compartment when they showed up. What would make Draco run into the Weasley's compartment - or a compartment with Gryffindors in it as opposed to staying with his own Slytherins? He was looking for comfort in a really odd place, and comfort from what exactly I wonder? I'm dying to know what the Dementors made Draco scared of, but I think HBP gave us plenty of hints. Just another thought. :)
ext_6866: (Good point.)

From: [identity profile] sistermagpie.livejournal.com

Re: Draco and the Dementors?


Oh yeah--I've always wondered about that Dementor bit! On one hand people seemed very quick to say it was just his general cowardice, and certainly it could have been just that he was scared of them in general, but it really is interesting to think that he was more scared of them than the average kid, especially given the events of HBP.

From: [identity profile] mahoni.livejournal.com


You know, I've always been inclined to see Draco as a hopeless cause, because he has always been such a delightfully two-dimensional, shallow bully. I liked the evil, nasty, small-time Draco of books 1 - 5.

But I agree with you about Draco as of HBP. I don't know that I think the groundwork was set down in previous books (like I said, I *liked* him shallow and nasty, and am happy to continue seeing him as such when I reread those books :P) but I do think we've seen enough of him in this book to suggest that he's not as evil as he liked to think he was, and that he's not, so far, a killer.

I guess I can see where the crying in the bathroom could have been stress, but I thought that the fact that his plan DID work, and there he was, on the tower, in prime position to kill Dumbledore, and yet he didn't do it - to me that indicated that when he told Myrtle "I can't do it" he didn't mean that he couldn't make the plan work, it meant that he couldn't conceive of himself killing Dumbledore.

At one point he gains confidence in his position, realizing that he has indeed succeeded and that Dumbledore is, as he says, at his mercy; I got the sense that he might be talking himself into doing it, and might, in another moment, be capable of killing. I suspect he must have given himself plenty of pep talks like that over the school year. Dumbledore pointing out that it was *his* mercy that mattered at that moment was, it seemed, the real turning point (Draco begins to lower his wand, and then a few moments later can't even 'pull the trigger' when the DE's are yelling at him to do it): I thought that was telling. Why is Dumbledore's mercy important? Does Draco hear it as a threat? Or does it illustrate to Draco what is really important? I think the latter; if it were the former, I think he would have been emboldened by the presence of the DEs. I think that Draco realized that the mercy of a man who will forgive his sins and let him walk a different path was more important than the kind of mercy Voldemort was trying to teach him: the kind of mercy that is merely the opposite of cruelty, tyranny, and lack of respect for life. It seems to me that Draco chose Dumbledore's way, and it seems to me also that he wouldn't have done so if he had never wanted to chose that way.

At any rate, that's how I read it. I'm fully prepared to be proven wrong in book seven, though, if the truth is something else. I mean, I pretty much buy whatever Rowling is selling at every step of the way. :D

This is sort of a tangent, but reading others' comments made me think of a couple of other things I liked about the tower scene. One was Draco insisting to Dumbledore that he hadn't invited Fenrir - it's such a sad little thing, the fact that he feels it important to defend his moral standards to the man he had lured up there to kill. I also liked that Harry gave Draco the benefit of the doubt. Harry could have been blinded by the fact that Draco Malfoy, evil wart on Harry's Hogwarts existence, set the whole thing up and drew Dumbledore to the tower to kill him, not to mention was responsible for what happened to Ron and Katie. He wasn't blinded, though; later he feels sure he saw Draco lower his wand, and he wonders what's happening to Draco, wherever he is, and pities him. Harry is really stepping into the world, and beginning to not only accept shades of gray, but take them to heart as well.

From: [identity profile] impinc.livejournal.com


One was Draco insisting to Dumbledore that he hadn't invited Fenrir - it's such a sad little thing, the fact that he feels it important to defend his moral standards to the man he had lured up there to kill.

Yes. That was really a heartbreaking part of the scene.

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From: [identity profile] strangemuses.livejournal.com


Amen to all above. How lovely was it that Dumbledore's last words of wisdom were spoken to Draco and not Harry? To me it implied a hidden, parallel arc through all 6 books that we have only finally been allowed to see.

Quick question: the ultimate "allegience" of Draco, Snape, and Percy is left undeclared until Book 7. Am I missing anyone?

Why was Tonks outside the RoR? I don't believe it was coincidental that Harry bumped into her there.
ext_6866: (Default)

From: [identity profile] sistermagpie.livejournal.com


Amen to all above. How lovely was it that Dumbledore's last words of wisdom were spoken to Draco and not Harry? To me it implied a hidden, parallel arc through all 6 books that we have only finally been allowed to see.

Yes, and thank goodness. When I was re-reading OotP I kept wondering if there was an implied story there, actually. Harry sees that glimpse of Draco with the other DE kids in the library after his article's published, and the IS starts up after that, then Lucius is jailed.

Quick question: the ultimate "allegience" of Draco, Snape, and Percy is left undeclared until Book 7. Am I missing anyone?

At first I thought I thought of someone and now I can't think of anyone. Draco, Snape, Percy...I suppose we might add that we don't ultimately know the fate of Regulus Black as well. And Narcissa, though now allied with Voldemort, should probably be considered to be on Draco's side.

I do wonder about Tonks--what was she doing there?? Was she just wandering around because it was a convenient time to slip her in? I read one theory about her being Narcissa in disguise!

From: [identity profile] impinc.livejournal.com


Oh, Draco. *sighs* Poor boy.

Anyway, I really like this. You seem to have a grasp on Draco's character that no other meta-writer I can think of does.
ext_6866: (I'll just watch from up here)

From: [identity profile] sistermagpie.livejournal.com


Thanks! Here's hoping my grasp is somewhere in the vicinity of the author's!:-)

From: [identity profile] romeo-ambiences.livejournal.com


There's something about Draco that's been stressed over and over in previous books that was so obvious I didn’t even see it: Draco is a boy to whom death is unreal.

And even more basic....a boy.

I know nothing about astrology, but when JKR released a birthdate for Draco, I was surprised and extremely curious. Why is she giving us birthdates for some of the characters and especially this one whom so many considered a nonentity.

Gemini is the zodiac's Adolescent.
JKR lets us know that Draco is not of age (nor is Harry) when most of HBP takes place.
Dumbledore refers to Draco as an innocent.

A person, especially a child, who is free of evil or sin.
A simple, guileless, inexperienced, or unsophisticated person.
A very young child.

I feel as if JKR is trying to beat this thru my head, but maybe that feeling is just the marbles rolling about.

I am insanely curious to look up info on other birthdates released....Snape especially. Can someone give me those?
So many Gemini traits seem prominent in Draco. Gah...I need to hang out with the centaurs.

From: [identity profile] http://users.livejournal.com/_rp_zeal_/


January: 9, Severus Snape

March: 1, Ron Weasley

Remus Lupin 10th March

April: 1, Fred and George Weasley

Pomona Sprout 15th May

July: 30, Neville Longbottom.
31, Harry Potter.

August: 11, Ginny Weasley.
22, Percy Weasley.

September: 19, Hermione.

October: 4, Minerva McGonagall.
17, Filius Flitwick.

30, Molly Weasley.

November: 29, Bill Weasley.

December: 6, (Rubeus?) Hagrid.
12, Charlie Weasley.


Yes! While throughout the first 5 books my view on Draco has consistently been that he's simply a child, an amoral, immature, nasty but nevertheless innocent child, in book 6 Rowling did painstakingly drop all these reminders of Draco's innocence and youth. (How many times did one character or another have to tell Harry that Draco was 16! And the potion class bit where Slughorn asked that rhetoric question if Draco etc were too young to do appration test, I was all 'glee'! For knowing Draco's exact birthdate ;-)
We thought Rowling's giving Draco a birthdate bode well for him, but at the time no one had imagined the magnitude of pleasant surprise that was merely weeks ahead of us.

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From: [identity profile] romeo-ambiences.livejournal.com - Date: 2005-07-20 01:39 am (UTC) - Expand

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From: [personal profile] anehan - Date: 2005-07-20 03:48 pm (UTC) - Expand

From: [identity profile] viverra-libro.livejournal.com


I think your essay/post is really good; I've said similar things in my journal. The one thing I'd point out to you is that Draco is a little farther down the road to Eville (pun!) than perhaps you have emphasized.

Draco is highly likely to have been marked, which in and of itself requires a certain dedication to, well, at least lawlesseness. Further, he's committed crimes that would merit him a stiff penalty from the Ministry under the best of circumstances:

-- He kept Rosmerta under Imperius for a considerable length of time. Doing so apparently requires both a focus of will as well as a good bit of power. That is a serious offense under the HP-verse rules, isn't it?

-- He did attempt to murder DD on at least two occasions, and ended up battering two students. In the real world, that would be two counts of attempted murder; the fact that he didn't get the person he was aiming for (so to speak) would be immaterial. I imagine that there would be some penalty associated with that as well, under the HP-verse rules.

-- He also allowed the DEs entrance to Hogwarts, and at least one person other than DD was killed, weren't they? Draco's at least an accessory to murder for that.

-- Draco is also an accessory to the injuries sustained by every person that F. bit, including Bill Weasley. Many peoples' lives are irrevocably harmed due to his actions.

So that's quite a productive year he's had.

Now I am all for Draco and his daddy living long happy lives, and joining up with the good guys so the two of them and Sev can have a threesome. But I think it's debatable which way Draco would really go. If Severus were in actuality committed to the forces of evil, I think that his influence could push Draco into being what it is he thinks he should be - a remorseless death eater, working to restore his family's name where it counts - with the Dark Lord. But in actuality (in the book, anyway) I think there's no question that Severus is still a good guy. Possibly The Good Guy. So I'm sure he'll straighten Draco out.

Now if you all would kindly go write terribly naughty pr0n about all the ways in which Severus has to teach Draco right from wrong, and to atone for his sins, I'd thank you greatly!

From: [identity profile] romeo-ambiences.livejournal.com


Draco is highly likely to have been marked

You know, Harry was assuming the Draco was showing his dark mark in B & B...I wonder...(wishes my memory were as good as many others)...could he have used one of twins' edible dark marks?

at least one person other than DD was killed

I thought the body was Bill's, injured not killed but I could be wrong.

Essentially, I agree....he has done many things that are wrong. Our muggle laws have degrees to which you are guilty of something....even murder. I find it relevant (as do both Dumbledore and Harry) that he is under extreme coercion to do these things....there's a wand at his head.

I do feel he needs to make some sort of compensation for what he has been responsible for....but you know....this world has been really lax about fair punishment (for the "good" guys included!!!).

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From: [identity profile] fuckmeharddraco.livejournal.com


Awesome essay. I love how you bring in the phrase 'the dark night of the soul.' And it was very clear that he could not see thestrals, and now he does, and we can only wait to see what this will mean for him in the last book.

From: [identity profile] hellspoette.livejournal.com


Do you write fanfiction at all? You have such wonderfully clear diction and a brightly analytical mind; I'd love to read any stories you come up with. I agree with all and sundry you stated...

HP is kind of unique in that it's a story where you can literally talk to murder victims and that's what Draco does in HBP. Does he know who Myrtle is? Probably not. But surely it's important who she is. She's the very girl he happily told stories about in second year, "The last time the Chamber was opened, a Mudblood died." She's Voldemort the schoolboy's first murder victim who’s now comforting Draco about his problem. Probably neither of them know that they've been stuck in the bathroom by the exact same guy, or that they should be natural enemies.

I was dimly aware of the irony of Malfoy being comforted by Myrtle, but I don't think I fully realized the strongly symbolic nature of such a little thing until I read that. The very idea is feeding the growing plot bunny that has taken up residence in my bedroom since I finished HBP... I'm thinking of writing a H/D-centric fic, and if I do, I'm going to have to credit you for putting out so much food-for-thought.
ext_6866: (Yum!)

From: [identity profile] sistermagpie.livejournal.com


Do you write fanfiction at all? You have such wonderfully clear diction and a brightly analytical mind; I'd love to read any stories you come up with. I agree with all and sundry you stated...

Thank you! I don't write fanfic at all, as it turns out.:-)

The very idea is feeding the growing plot bunny that has taken up residence in my bedroom since I finished HBP... I'm thinking of writing a H/D-centric fic, and if I do, I'm going to have to credit you for putting out so much food-for-thought.

Hurray! Yes! Do it!

From: [identity profile] nimriye.livejournal.com


Hi! I uh, got here kind of randomly, but ever since I saw your first post about Draco I've been coming back to see your subsequent posts. I absolutely adore the grasp you have on Draco's character, and there's no one else whose analysis of Draco in HBP I've liked and agreed with so much.

And while, scrolling a few comments up, we're on the subject of JKR revealing Draco's birthdate, I found something interesting concerning that birthdate which-- well, okay, I've always disdained digging way too deep trying to scrabble for a meaning, but this had resonance with what happened for Draco in HBP, and I did not know if you might be interested in seeing it: as it rather ties in with some of your points about Draco.

The Druids identified thirteen trees in a system similar to the horoscopes: each tree rules a period of days that affects the personality and future of the person born during that period. Supposedly, a wand made from the wood of one's birth tree will be more compatible for the wielder: and since Harry's birth tree happens to be holly (as is his wand), JKR may well be aware of and using this system. In fact, I believe Hermione also uses a wand made from the wood of her birth tree: vine.

Draco's birth tree, according to this system, is hawthorn: The Whitethorn or Hawthorn or May Witch takes its name from the May. It is considered by some to be a generally unlucky tree and its name, translated from the Irish Brehon Laws, had the meaning "harm". Alternately, it has been used to purge places from evil and negativity. It is used to break old habits and rid yourself of negativity... ...Make a ball of last year's foliage tied with a white ribbon and burn it in a bonfire on New Year's day to rid yourself of troubles. Start fresh in the New Year then by making yourself a ball of fresh thorn branches and leaves and keep it to be used in the next year's bonfire.

So, I imagine that mostly adds up to just a lot of rather far-fetched conjecture from an avid Draco fan (again with my disdain for searching way too deep for meanings) but I found it interesting that Draco's birth tree has negative/unlucky/harmful meanings, but at the same time represents the purgation of evil and negativity and the abandoning of old bad habits. It remains to be seen whether this is the path JKR'll take Draco on.

And that was also very spammy! My apologies if you knew that already, but if you did I guess it can still read by other Draco fans who didn't. I imagine a lot of them will come here to read your posts on him, because they really are fabulous.
ext_6866: (Moon magic)

From: [identity profile] sistermagpie.livejournal.com


Thank you! I just hope my analysis is in the right ballpark. I admit I love the thing about Draco's tree! I guess Neville's isn't correct given his wand (cherry/unicorn) but she may be using different connections for different people.

One thing I would definitely love when the series was over would be a big book giving just that kind of information, like the wands, boggarts and Dementors of all the various characters.

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From: [identity profile] nimriye.livejournal.com - Date: 2005-07-21 11:02 pm (UTC) - Expand

From: [identity profile] shusu.livejournal.com


Your last line is absolutely chilling.

And true.

I thought too of the first book. He ran from death, ran from the scene of the most evil being murdering a pure innocent. He never got to see it. One wonders what would have happened if he hadn't... otherwise it's a perfect metaphor, a pattern's start, for what you're saying here.
ext_6866: (Boo.)

From: [identity profile] sistermagpie.livejournal.com


Hee-thanks! And yeah, I remember recently wondering what Draco's boggart would be and thinking *he* might very well have been the one who saw Voldemort drinking that unicorn blood as opposed to Harry's Dementor.

From: [identity profile] joyfulgirl1013.livejournal.com


Another excellent post about Draco! I'm so excited that you're doing a series of them, because your ideas are always so interesting and, above all, well articulated. :) I especially enjoyed this one, though, because the idea about Draco's not really understanding death is one I've been pushing for a while, but one with which, for some reason, a lot of people have refused to agree. I've even tried comparing it to small children and violent video games, and they still refused to get it. Bah. Bravo for actually taking the time and pulling together all the evidence!

One thing I wonder, though, is whether Draco himself will see his choice in the same light that we do. You've provided good evidence suggesting that the thought of killing Dumbledore wasn't a happy one for him, but I feel as though Draco himself would still chalk this up to his own weakness afterwards, as would everyone around him. He's failed once again. And while I think he's gained some more insight as to what death actually is and perhaps is not so gung-ho about murder anymore, he himself might, once again, call this same insight weakness. It's interesting that you bring up Ginny Weasley here, because you'd think that after the horrible things Tom Riddle forced her to do, she wouldn't be so enthusiastic about such a horrible curse. But there you go.

Perhaps this is another reason Harry had to witness this. To remind Draco in the future. Or something. I'm not really sure. Just thought I'd put it out there.
ext_6866: (Moon magic)

From: [identity profile] sistermagpie.livejournal.com


Thanks! I've got meta coming out of my ears with this book, apparently.

It's true we don't at all know how Draco will react to his own failure. It could go a lot of different ways. Regulus appeared to face exactly the same problem and he wound up dead. The one thing is that you have to think that having someone who doesn't really want to be where he is is a weakness for Voldemort. Draco surprised both the leaders in this book--Voldemort expected him to die in the attempt to kill Dumbledore and he didn't. He got the DEs into Hogwarts. Dumbledore was caught unawares by his getting the DEs in as well. The fact that he was able to surprise both these guys with his abilities says to me he could do it again. The tower on one hand took away his last hope by taking away Dumbledore. At the same time, though, it validated his own personal power.
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