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I was on HP4GU today and realized there was an actual Draco-related issue in HBP that I hadn't written thousands of words about--and it relates to Snape too! Anyway, we were talking about Harry feeling remorse about Sectumsempra even though it was self-defense yadda yadda, and I realized there was something I was kind of dancing around in talking about the scene that seemed really obvious but I actually don't think I've ever read much about it from this angle.
Ironically, the main references I have seen to Draco’s tears in discussions of Harry’s remorse were strictly defenses of Harry, saying that was moved by Draco's crying and maybe would have helped him if Malfoy hadn't gone postal, so Harry’s all the more innocent. (Regarding Draco the main question I've seen discussed is whether he's just afraid of failing or feeling anything more.)
To me the crying is more important than that. I think it was an intentional and important decision of JKR's to put the crying together with Sectumsempra. She was, as usual, pulling lots of threads together into one dramatic scene. On the mundane plot level, of course, she's just using this scene to get a number of things out of the way--she reveals that the boy Myrtle was meeting was Malfoy, reveals Malfoy's fear and the fact he's being threatened, and also reveals Sectumsempra and shows Snape that Harry's got his book etc. One poster (Carol) I think was also correct in saying Harry is learning the same important distinction Snape feels for him--he hates Draco, but he does not want him dead (more importantly, he doesn't want to kill him).
But I think there's another thing going on as well. I had in the past said I didn't think we could take it as a given that Harry would have been so sympathetic to Malfoy just because he saw him crying--after all, he's upset over the very thing that Harry wants to get him for. However Harry might have felt if Malfoy hadn't attacked him, he actually isn't sympathetic in the scene. His feelings are described as:
At the point Malfoy wheels around all Harry has felt is shock, a shock so huge that it "roots him to the spot" and keeps him from doing what he probably would have done had he found Malfoy just talking to Myrtle, which is hide and listen. Not stand there like a sitting duck in full view for a pretty long moment.
And the question is--why is he so shocked for so long? He's not just surprised here (like Malfoy when he found Harry and Snape doing their Occlumency lessons), he's so shocked he's having trouble taking it in. That shock is drawn out for two sentences, first Harry being physically rooted to where he's standing, then having to go over what he's seeing ("Malfoy was crying --actually crying --"). He's transfixed watching the physical crying--the tears falling into the basin, the gulping sobs. But what's so shocking here? I mean, so shocking that Harry has so much trouble processing it?
It's not shocking to a lot of readers, presumably. Myrtle's already told us some boy was crying in the bathroom and the law of character conservation made Malfoy the obvious candidate. Harry himself has been watching Malfoy's physical deterioration all year and been pleased by it because he knows it means the Voldemort plot isn't going well. Usually Malfoy in any kind of distress makes Harry pleased.
So what's so different here that it's so shocking? I think the idea is that Harry is shocked at suddenly seeing Malfoy, cliché as it sounds, as a real person. In the past the only feelings Harry's ever saw in Malfoy were negative ones: he's menacing, he hates Harry, he's a coward. He's also seen fake ones: he sucks up to people, he boasts, he struts, he plays up injuries. Did Harry really not see the vulnerability in him that many readers saw? Well, no, he probably didn't. As early as the Sorting scene Harry has actually imbued Malfoy with a sense of well-being and confidence so big he sees any evidence against it as a welcome, temporary aberration. I don't think it's unreasonable to say that up until that moment Harry really never has seen Malfoy as a boy like himself who might actually feel the same things Harry feels at times and have similar motivations. (It's really interesting the way it's both like and unlike the Pensieve scene with Snape, perhaps because Snape and Malfoy represent different shadows to Harry.)
I realize this sounds really cliché--but JKR isn't afraid of clichés when she's set them up well, and she has here. There's a reason this moment had already occurred in a hundred H/D fics before she wrote it. It's not about Harry suddenly feeling sorry for Malfoy--he doesn't in the scene. It's somehow exploding something that until that moment he'd taken for granted about Malfoy, something I doubt he'd ever really been aware of. Apparently Malfoy crying -- actually crying -- really is a shock for Harry who has more than once in the past wanted to cause him as much pain as possible. I’m not even sure just what it’s exploded—but maybe Harry doesn’t either. It’s not something he can immediately articulate like he can with James and Snape in the Pensieve (James is being an asshole and he’s supposed to be cool; I felt sorry for Snape and that’s all kinds of wrong because he’s usually the bully).
There's something about that moment that makes Malfoy different, and then it's immediately choked off--just as Harry's fleeting confusion about Snape after the Pensieve is choked off by Snape attacking him. Malfoy attacks him (he knows it's a naked moment, certainly), Harry instinctively defends himself. And this is the fight that leads to Harry hurting Malfoy more than he ever has, more than he imagined or really intended. I feel like you can't separate the two things completely. Even acknowledging that Harry was acting in self defense, this isn't just another scene where Harry strikes back at the Malfoy he knew before who was asking for it. Throughout the whole fight Harry is actually more strangely empathetic than Malfoy than he ever has been, I suspect.
Perhaps that's another reason Harry doesn't think about Malfoy at all after that. It's not just guilt at his (fixed) actions, perhaps, but the discomfort of his new intimacy with Malfoy. I'm not even sure if Harry told his friends about the crying--you'd think they'd have said something about it. He may still be having trouble processing it. The fight can distract him from it, but I think it's also connected to why he feels badly. I don't mean anything so literal as just Harry feels bad because he not only hurt Malfoy but Malfoy was sad right before he did it. I think it's more subtle.
Subtle, btw, in a way I again think parallels Snape. Harry also saw him in the exact kind of vulnerable moment he didn't associate with him, Snape also responded by attacking Harry, Harry defended himself again, focusing more on the unfair accusations. It's also kind of funny that this is Snape and Malfoy, both of whom are connected to Occlumency by Rowling. Occlumency, which she relates to cutting oneself off from feelings, which both Snape and Draco consider potential weaknesses even though they seem at heart more emotional than Harry (or in different ways). Harry has seen exactly what these two characters are always trying to hide, and up until the moments they hit him in the face, they were successful at hiding them from Harry.
Btw, how much do I love Stephen Colbert for putting Gwyneth Paltrow's head on his shelf? It's still the best moment in her career, imo.
Ironically, the main references I have seen to Draco’s tears in discussions of Harry’s remorse were strictly defenses of Harry, saying that was moved by Draco's crying and maybe would have helped him if Malfoy hadn't gone postal, so Harry’s all the more innocent. (Regarding Draco the main question I've seen discussed is whether he's just afraid of failing or feeling anything more.)
To me the crying is more important than that. I think it was an intentional and important decision of JKR's to put the crying together with Sectumsempra. She was, as usual, pulling lots of threads together into one dramatic scene. On the mundane plot level, of course, she's just using this scene to get a number of things out of the way--she reveals that the boy Myrtle was meeting was Malfoy, reveals Malfoy's fear and the fact he's being threatened, and also reveals Sectumsempra and shows Snape that Harry's got his book etc. One poster (Carol) I think was also correct in saying Harry is learning the same important distinction Snape feels for him--he hates Draco, but he does not want him dead (more importantly, he doesn't want to kill him).
But I think there's another thing going on as well. I had in the past said I didn't think we could take it as a given that Harry would have been so sympathetic to Malfoy just because he saw him crying--after all, he's upset over the very thing that Harry wants to get him for. However Harry might have felt if Malfoy hadn't attacked him, he actually isn't sympathetic in the scene. His feelings are described as:
"And Harry realised, with a shock so huge it seemed to root him to the spot, that Malfoy was crying -- actually crying -- tears streaming down his pale face into the grimy basin. Malfoy gasped and gulped and then, with a great shudder, looked up into the cracked mirror and saw Harry staring at him over his shoulder. Malfoy wheeled round, drawing his wand. Instinctively Harry pulled out his own."
At the point Malfoy wheels around all Harry has felt is shock, a shock so huge that it "roots him to the spot" and keeps him from doing what he probably would have done had he found Malfoy just talking to Myrtle, which is hide and listen. Not stand there like a sitting duck in full view for a pretty long moment.
And the question is--why is he so shocked for so long? He's not just surprised here (like Malfoy when he found Harry and Snape doing their Occlumency lessons), he's so shocked he's having trouble taking it in. That shock is drawn out for two sentences, first Harry being physically rooted to where he's standing, then having to go over what he's seeing ("Malfoy was crying --actually crying --"). He's transfixed watching the physical crying--the tears falling into the basin, the gulping sobs. But what's so shocking here? I mean, so shocking that Harry has so much trouble processing it?
It's not shocking to a lot of readers, presumably. Myrtle's already told us some boy was crying in the bathroom and the law of character conservation made Malfoy the obvious candidate. Harry himself has been watching Malfoy's physical deterioration all year and been pleased by it because he knows it means the Voldemort plot isn't going well. Usually Malfoy in any kind of distress makes Harry pleased.
So what's so different here that it's so shocking? I think the idea is that Harry is shocked at suddenly seeing Malfoy, cliché as it sounds, as a real person. In the past the only feelings Harry's ever saw in Malfoy were negative ones: he's menacing, he hates Harry, he's a coward. He's also seen fake ones: he sucks up to people, he boasts, he struts, he plays up injuries. Did Harry really not see the vulnerability in him that many readers saw? Well, no, he probably didn't. As early as the Sorting scene Harry has actually imbued Malfoy with a sense of well-being and confidence so big he sees any evidence against it as a welcome, temporary aberration. I don't think it's unreasonable to say that up until that moment Harry really never has seen Malfoy as a boy like himself who might actually feel the same things Harry feels at times and have similar motivations. (It's really interesting the way it's both like and unlike the Pensieve scene with Snape, perhaps because Snape and Malfoy represent different shadows to Harry.)
I realize this sounds really cliché--but JKR isn't afraid of clichés when she's set them up well, and she has here. There's a reason this moment had already occurred in a hundred H/D fics before she wrote it. It's not about Harry suddenly feeling sorry for Malfoy--he doesn't in the scene. It's somehow exploding something that until that moment he'd taken for granted about Malfoy, something I doubt he'd ever really been aware of. Apparently Malfoy crying -- actually crying -- really is a shock for Harry who has more than once in the past wanted to cause him as much pain as possible. I’m not even sure just what it’s exploded—but maybe Harry doesn’t either. It’s not something he can immediately articulate like he can with James and Snape in the Pensieve (James is being an asshole and he’s supposed to be cool; I felt sorry for Snape and that’s all kinds of wrong because he’s usually the bully).
There's something about that moment that makes Malfoy different, and then it's immediately choked off--just as Harry's fleeting confusion about Snape after the Pensieve is choked off by Snape attacking him. Malfoy attacks him (he knows it's a naked moment, certainly), Harry instinctively defends himself. And this is the fight that leads to Harry hurting Malfoy more than he ever has, more than he imagined or really intended. I feel like you can't separate the two things completely. Even acknowledging that Harry was acting in self defense, this isn't just another scene where Harry strikes back at the Malfoy he knew before who was asking for it. Throughout the whole fight Harry is actually more strangely empathetic than Malfoy than he ever has been, I suspect.
Perhaps that's another reason Harry doesn't think about Malfoy at all after that. It's not just guilt at his (fixed) actions, perhaps, but the discomfort of his new intimacy with Malfoy. I'm not even sure if Harry told his friends about the crying--you'd think they'd have said something about it. He may still be having trouble processing it. The fight can distract him from it, but I think it's also connected to why he feels badly. I don't mean anything so literal as just Harry feels bad because he not only hurt Malfoy but Malfoy was sad right before he did it. I think it's more subtle.
Subtle, btw, in a way I again think parallels Snape. Harry also saw him in the exact kind of vulnerable moment he didn't associate with him, Snape also responded by attacking Harry, Harry defended himself again, focusing more on the unfair accusations. It's also kind of funny that this is Snape and Malfoy, both of whom are connected to Occlumency by Rowling. Occlumency, which she relates to cutting oneself off from feelings, which both Snape and Draco consider potential weaknesses even though they seem at heart more emotional than Harry (or in different ways). Harry has seen exactly what these two characters are always trying to hide, and up until the moments they hit him in the face, they were successful at hiding them from Harry.
Btw, how much do I love Stephen Colbert for putting Gwyneth Paltrow's head on his shelf? It's still the best moment in her career, imo.
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Those moments where Draco tries to be more assertive would come off as hokey except that the Harry-filter (and, well, maybe the Deatheater part, too) makes it seem kind of sinister. And then of course there's a related kind of breakdown he experiences when things really are implicitly sinister. If you compare the ways he insults Ron and Hermione, he's much more imaginative and verbally playful when he's getting to Ron, and much cruder and grosser with Hermione: "Is your mother really that porky or is it just the photograph?" vs. "If you're wondering what that smell is . . . " So is the Mudblood issue a focus of some anxiety for him? As Elkins points out, in "Draco the Nutter," when anything having to do with Voldemort and Pureblood rule comes up Draco actually starts getting flushed and shrill, a little bit shaky, and that signals the very opposite of the confidence he's trying to convey.
So just like in the discussion about Snape where we both flagged some abrupt departures from Draco's normal behavior as signs of a daddy-button being pressed, I wonder if we can also see some of his more socially gross moments as flagging anxiety-buttons that would normally be hidden. There may be a pattern to this, to those moments where he makes an ass of himself in one of these ways, where he comes off as a too-obvious poseur, so that they represent an authorial marker indicating areas where Draco a bit divided within himself. Issues of status, dominance, feelings of superiority or inferiority, and their reflections in WW high politics seem to be the areas of obsessive interest, areas where he's least comfortable in his own skin.
I don't know. Again, I could be massively overreading. And hypothesis-testing is ever so much more time-consuming than hypothesis-generating. :) But another application of this idea, he says, quickly changing the subject, is to the question of Draco's friendships. I said in the other thread that some of his behavior ought to get his head flushed in the toilet; you said somewhat more humanely that his friends may just be on to his B.S. and love him anyway. If his more obnoxious and awkward behavior is bounded in this way, linked to specific situations and hot buttons, then you're probably on to something -- his friends can just see it as "oh well, Draco's off on one of his hobbyhorses again" and roll their eyes and find plenty of other things to like about him.
Hmmmm. I'm not sure that's as strong a case as I hoped it would be. But what the hell, it's a warmup. :) Nice to be back in the thread with you, and I hope you haven't got thoroughly sick of it in the interim. :)
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Today was like an early Xmas--so many BD comments! Weeee!
I love that you brought up that Rememberall scene because it always stands out in my mind and I'm never sure why. Part of it is while Harry responds to it immediately as bullying, and I can see why, it never quite feels that way to me. What you're describing here is along the same lines--you're saying that Draco is trying out a type of behavior that's not supposed to be exactly negative. When I read it that's kind of what it sounded like too. He's not starting a fight--as you say, he's in front of teachers and besides, he's not angry. We've seen him when he's actually trying to make Harry or someone angry.
When I read it it almost felt like just trying to aggressively insert himself into a conversation. Almost like in GoF when he appears in the Gryffindor's train car--not to fight but to talk about the Tournament. He arrives with an insult, but a different boy could pull off that kind of casual dominance (and he's smoother in GoF). But it felt like that's what he was trying to do.
Draco can't pull it off and because Harry won't allow him to try. He immediately goes straight to actual dominance. Had Harry reacted a little more cautiously and seen where he was going it might not have been as bad as he imagined. When Draco actually takes the Rememberall later Harry also immediately makes it into a fight for dominance--when Harry says, "Give it here!" when Draco's picked up the forgotten Rememberall for his own type of show, Draco can't give it to him or he'd be showing total submission. His actions in that altercation are kind of trying to just get out of it with as little trouble as possible.
Often enough Draco really is pretty suave, in his own way -- he's spontaneous, funny, verbally fluent, clever and effective about scoring his points
Yes--getting into my PR thing (which I will link to when it's posted because I would love to get your thoughts if I can go over what I'm thinking) there's some comparison of him and Dudley and looking at just how much Draco is connected to a certain kind of social success/fighting. Through Harry's eyes he never looks too good, but even then we sometimes get some these odd things like how Malfoy was "holding court" at the Slytherin table. So maybe, as you say, Draco actually is a fun guy to be friends with in other ways that Harry would never see. I have always noticed that certainly he works for his friends. Where Harry kind of draws people no matter what he does for them (in OotP friendship with Harry is particularly one-sided-Ron's all on his own with his Quidditch woes). Draco's usually working hard to entertain with his friends--he tells stories, tells jokes, does impressions.
That's not what he's ever doing with Harry--though there's still a couple of places with Ron where his insults, as you say, are more sophisticated. With Hermione he's crude, with Harry he's sometimes stupid but sometimes more clever. I genuinely liked, for instance, his comeback to Ron's bragging about Harry's Nimbus in PS by putting down Malfoy's Comet (something like: Weasley, do you even have a broom? I suppose you and your brothers have to save up twig by twig?). It's withering, but it's also funny and not too much given Ron's own attempt to put him down.
If his friends more often see him being funny they could have more of a sense of his weak spots--particularly since they're not always around when Draco's at his worst in front of Harry. You don't want to make it all a Daddy issue, but damn it makes sense given the Lucius we've seen. Ironically, Draco might do okay just trying to be Lucius' public face, schmoozing and donating money. But he's totally missing some of the other core Lucius qualities. And Lucius can't teach him because he kind of sucks that way.
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Anyway, I think we definitely see the Remembrall scene in the same way. And it was interesting that your latest DTCL post sort of put the broom incident in the same perspective -- Draco's just being grabby because that's how he shows his interest, it's not like he's going to snap the broom in the middle of the Entrance Hall. Lucius may have forgot to tell him what to do when this thing doesn't work. But all the sinister spin, here and in the flying lesson, is Harry's projection, and he immediately puts Draco in an impossible position.
Of course it gets worse, and eventually becomes genuinely nasty, as the series goes on. It's kind of fascinating to watch Harry escalate minor awkwardnesses into permanent bad feelings, with Draco, with Zach, maybe even in a sense with Snape. But you get the feeling that most of Harry's adversaries get to a point where they're thinking "WTF? You're taking this way too seriously!"
You don't want to make it all a Daddy issue, but damn it makes sense given the Lucius we've seen . . . he's totally missing some of the other core Lucius qualities. And Lucius can't teach him because he kind of sucks that way.
Yeah, and this might make even the parenting issue less sinister and more ordinarily tragic. Lucius isn't necessarily a bad parent because he's a bad person. He's a bad parent because he doesn't make allowance for the fact that Draco's personality is very different from his own. He thinks he can mold him, instead of adapting his approach to who Draco is. It's the old tabula rasa fallacy, just ordinary interpersonal stupidity.
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It's kind of fascinating to watch Harry escalate minor awkwardnesses into permanent bad feelings, with Draco, with Zach, maybe even in a sense with Snape.
And yet so far one of the problems is, of course, that few people step out of Harry's pov enough to recognize that he's escalating. In the last "Blame Game" I was in some ways most shocked by the number of people who thought Zach was at fault in the scene where Ginny ran into him on her broom because "he's an asshat." Not only is Zach just not that bad, but it's not like fanon ever seemed to see him as such itself. But in HBP we've got Harry and Ginny talking about him as an idiot and a jerk, he makes them angry, and so suddenly yeah, he was really a jerk.
With Draco, too, sometimes the people most open to his story in HBP seem people who either like the character and so looked at him closely or through rose-colored glasses, and people who never cared much about him and were neutral. It's harder to let go, imo, of the view that took Harry's hatred and created a character to match.
He's a bad parent because he doesn't make allowance for the fact that Draco's personality is very different from his own.
Yup. He seems genuinely clueless that a child is not automatically something you've got under control, you know? He tells Draco to play nice with Harry but doesn't seem to really be putting an effort into making him do that. He thinks he can spin tales of LV and the Heir and then keep Draco out of it just by saying to keep his head down.